Using acct codes for entering accts in a register

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Using acct codes for entering accts in a register

Ken Heard-2
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In entering accounts in a register I would like to be able to use
account codes instead of account names for that purpose.  Where in
GnuCash do I make that change?

I also want to show account lists either in a tree, or in line without
any indents for the account hierarchy.  Where in GnuCash is that option?

Regards, Ken Heard

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Re: Using acct codes for entering accts in a register

GnuCash - User mailing list
I don’t believe there are settings specific to your requests.

With regard to the first, however, I have heard from others that you can work around this by including the account code as part of the account name, e.g., “1000. Assets.” Then you can use quickfill to rapidly drill down through the hierarchy.

As for the second, you might use a report to get the list formatted the way you want. I don’t think the Chart of Accounts allows the changes you’re describing.

David

> On Feb 18, 2017, at 2:33 PM, Ken Heard <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
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> Hash: SHA1
>
> In entering accounts in a register I would like to be able to use
> account codes instead of account names for that purpose.  Where in
> GnuCash do I make that change?
>
> I also want to show account lists either in a tree, or in line without
> any indents for the account hierarchy.  Where in GnuCash is that option?
>
> Regards, Ken Heard

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What purpose is served by the Account Code field?

Ken Heard-2
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On 2017-02-18 19:10, David T. wrote:

> I don’t believe there are settings specific to your requests.

I was afraid of that.

> With regard to the first, however, I have heard from others that
> you can work around this by including the account code as part of
> the account name, e.g., “1000. Assets.” Then you can use quickfill
> to rapidly drill down through the hierarchy.

Yes that is one work-around.  Another is to reverse the roles of the
Account Code and the Account Name; put only the code in the latter and
only the name in the former.  The real question however is what is the
purpose of the Account Code field if not to be an alternative way to
select accounts in the register?

Is there any developer out there who can answer that question?  I
changed the name is this post in the hopes of attracting one.

> As for the second, you might use a report to get the list formatted
> the way you want. I don’t think the Chart of Accounts allows the
> changes you’re describing.

Since my original post I discovered that the left most column in the
accounts window -- whatever it may be -- is always a tree.  So if for
example the placeholder column is placed there it will be a tree, but
the account name column will not be.

Anyhow thanks for the reply; my ignorance of GnuCash is consequently
lessened.

Regards, Ken Heard


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Re: Using acct codes for entering accts in a register

David Carlson-4
In reply to this post by GnuCash - User mailing list
Ken,

Actually there is a field in the Account record for Account Number.  The
reason David T suggested putting the number directly as a prefix in the
account name is because that is a work-around for the fact that there is a
major bug in GnuCash that causes sorting by Account Number to be somewhat
weird for some account structures.  For me, the sorting by Account Number
seems good enough, so I use it regularly.

There is another drawback to using the Account Number field for some users
in that the drop-down list of accounts that appears during transaction
entry cannot be configured to show account numbers so you have to have your
account number hierarchy memorized or use a cheat sheet when entering by
account number.  Curiously, you can enter the account number in the account
name field and it works much more quickly than the
character,character,colon... method in my opinion.

David C

On Sat, Feb 18, 2017 at 6:10 AM, David T. via gnucash-user <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> I don’t believe there are settings specific to your requests.
>
> With regard to the first, however, I have heard from others that you can
> work around this by including the account code as part of the account name,
> e.g., “1000. Assets.” Then you can use quickfill to rapidly drill down
> through the hierarchy.
>
> As for the second, you might use a report to get the list formatted the
> way you want. I don’t think the Chart of Accounts allows the changes you’re
> describing.
>
> David
>
> > On Feb 18, 2017, at 2:33 PM, Ken Heard <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > In entering accounts in a register I would like to be able to use
> > account codes instead of account names for that purpose.  Where in
> > GnuCash do I make that change?
> >
> > I also want to show account lists either in a tree, or in line without
> > any indents for the account hierarchy.  Where in GnuCash is that option?
> >
> > Regards, Ken Heard
>
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Re: What purpose is served by the Account Code field?

David Carlson-4
In reply to this post by Ken Heard-2
Ken,

In my response to your earlier post I mentioned that you can enter the
account code in the account name field when entering transactions, and that
works nicely even tho there is no configuration to show the account code in
the account name field.

The account tree being fixed as the first column on the COA page is what
can interfere with sorting by account number if your tree deviates too much
from the traditional number schemes.

David C

On Sat, Feb 18, 2017 at 6:57 AM, Ken Heard <[hidden email]> wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> On 2017-02-18 19:10, David T. wrote:
>
> > I don’t believe there are settings specific to your requests.
>
> I was afraid of that.
>
> > With regard to the first, however, I have heard from others that
> > you can work around this by including the account code as part of
> > the account name, e.g., “1000. Assets.” Then you can use quickfill
> > to rapidly drill down through the hierarchy.
>
> Yes that is one work-around.  Another is to reverse the roles of the
> Account Code and the Account Name; put only the code in the latter and
> only the name in the former.  The real question however is what is the
> purpose of the Account Code field if not to be an alternative way to
> select accounts in the register?
>
> Is there any developer out there who can answer that question?  I
> changed the name is this post in the hopes of attracting one.
>
> > As for the second, you might use a report to get the list formatted
> > the way you want. I don’t think the Chart of Accounts allows the
> > changes you’re describing.
>
> Since my original post I discovered that the left most column in the
> accounts window -- whatever it may be -- is always a tree.  So if for
> example the placeholder column is placed there it will be a tree, but
> the account name column will not be.
>
> Anyhow thanks for the reply; my ignorance of GnuCash is consequently
> lessened.
>
> Regards, Ken Heard
>
>
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Re: Using acct codes for entering accts in a register

Ken Heard-2
In reply to this post by David Carlson-4
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David,

On 2017-02-18 20:09, David Carlson wrote:

> Actually there is a field in the Account record for Account
> Number.

In the version of GnuCash I am using (2.6.4), the latest available
Debian Wheezy (Jessie uses 2.6.11), there is an "Account Code" field
but not an "Account Number" field.  Do they both serve the same purpose?

> The reason David T suggested putting the number directly as a
> prefix in the account name is because that is a work-around for the
> fact that there is a major bug in GnuCash that causes sorting by
> Account Number to be somewhat weird for some account structures.
> For me, the sorting by Account Number seems good enough, so I use
> it regularly.

I can sort my accounts using the Account Code field without detectable
errors so far.  My codes are alphanumeric.

> There is another drawback to using the Account Number field for
> some users in that the drop-down list of accounts that appears
> during transaction entry cannot be configured to show account
> numbers so you have to have your account number hierarchy memorized
> or use a cheat sheet when entering by account number.  Curiously,
> you can enter the account number in the account name field and it
> works much more quickly than the character,character,colon...
> method in my opinion.

For account entries in registers where the Account Name field begins
with my alphanumeric code I can either enter the code manually or
select from the drop down without difficulty.  The only purpose I can
see for the Account Code field would be to allow manual or drop down
entry using the code alone but have both code and name appear in the
registry.  In view of the foregoing is this refinement worth the
struggle to get the Account Code to work that way?

I agree with you about the character:colon arrangement; I do not use
it unless I have to. So I can read it better I have replaced the colon
with a tilde.

Regards, Ken

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Re: What purpose is served by the Account Code field?

Ken Heard-2
In reply to this post by David Carlson-4
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David,

On 2017-02-18 20:17, David Carlson wrote:

> In my response to your earlier post I mentioned that you can enter
> the account code in the account name field when entering
> transactions, and that works nicely even though there is no
> configuration to show the account code in the account name field.
>
> The account tree being fixed as the first column on the COA page
> is what can interfere with sorting by account number if your tree
> deviates too much from the traditional number schemes.

I use the Placeholder field in the first column and have no trouble
sorting my accounts properly either with the alphanumeric code alone
in the Account Code field or the alphanumeric code preceding the name
in the Account Name field.

Regards, Ken

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Re: What purpose is served by the Account Code field?

GnuCash - User mailing list
In reply to this post by Ken Heard-2

> On Feb 18, 2017, at 5:57 PM, Ken Heard <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Since my original post I discovered that the left most column in the
> accounts window -- whatever it may be -- is always a tree.  So if for
> example the placeholder column is placed there it will be a tree, but
> the account name column will not be.

Interesting. I see what you describe. I wonder whether it was intended to have the first column be the locus of the tree structure; it is a little disconcerting to expand the account type, for example. Also, I note that if one puts the Account Color in this position, the tree display gets messed up, with the widgets being placed behind the data for the next column because the color column doesn’t resize. I’m not sure what alternative one would use, however.

Finally, it can be confusing if you have some accounts without codes, as it can be difficult to determine which portions of the tree are expanded, which aren’t, and where one part of the tree ends.

David
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Re: Using acct codes for entering accts in a register

David Carlson-4
In reply to this post by Ken Heard-2

   
I probably used the wrong name.  I only know of one field for account numbers.
David C 


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S® 5 ACTIVE™, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: Ken Heard <[hidden email]>
Date: 2/18/17  8:36 AM  (GMT-06:00)
To: gnucash-user <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Using acct codes for entering accts in a register

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Hash: SHA1

David,

On 2017-02-18 20:09, David Carlson wrote:

> Actually there is a field in the Account record for Account
> Number.

In the version of GnuCash I am using (2.6.4), the latest available
Debian Wheezy (Jessie uses 2.6.11), there is an "Account Code" field
but not an "Account Number" field.  Do they both serve the same purpose?

> The reason David T suggested putting the number directly as a
> prefix in the account name is because that is a work-around for the
> fact that there is a major bug in GnuCash that causes sorting by
> Account Number to be somewhat weird for some account structures.
> For me, the sorting by Account Number seems good enough, so I use
> it regularly.

I can sort my accounts using the Account Code field without detectable
errors so far.  My codes are alphanumeric.

> There is another drawback to using the Account Number field for
> some users in that the drop-down list of accounts that appears
> during transaction entry cannot be configured to show account
> numbers so you have to have your account number hierarchy memorized
> or use a cheat sheet when entering by account number.  Curiously,
> you can enter the account number in the account name field and it
> works much more quickly than the character,character,colon...
> method in my opinion.

For account entries in registers where the Account Name field begins
with my alphanumeric code I can either enter the code manually or
select from the drop down without difficulty.  The only purpose I can
see for the Account Code field would be to allow manual or drop down
entry using the code alone but have both code and name appear in the
registry.  In view of the foregoing is this refinement worth the
struggle to get the Account Code to work that way?

I agree with you about the character:colon arrangement; I do not use
it unless I have to. So I can read it better I have replaced the colon
with a tilde.

Regards, Ken

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Re: What purpose is served by the Account Code field?

Ken Heard-2
In reply to this post by GnuCash - User mailing list
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On 2017-02-19 00:42, David T. wrote:

>
>> On Feb 18, 2017, at 5:57 PM, Ken Heard <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Since my original post I discovered that the left most column in
>> the accounts window -- whatever it may be -- is always a tree.
>> So if for example the placeholder column is placed there it will
>> be a tree, but the account name column will not be.
>
> Interesting. I see what you describe. I wonder whether it was
> intended to have the first column be the locus of the tree
> structure; it is a little disconcerting to expand the account type,
> for example. Also, I note that if one puts the Account Color in
> this position, the tree display gets messed up, with the widgets
> being placed behind the data for the next column because the color
> column doesn’t resize. I’m not sure what alternative one would use,
> however.

For me the obvious solution would be not to use the colour option, a
needless complication causing more trouble than it is worth.

> Finally, it can be confusing if you have some accounts without
> codes, as it can be difficult to determine which portions of the
> tree are expanded, which aren’t, and where one part of the tree
> ends.

I have given all my accounts a both a code and a name in both the
Account Code and Account Name fields in the format "code: name".  So
the entries in both those fields are identical, although as I have
already said I see no purpose in the Account Code field.

(In order to use the colon as above I had to change in preferences the
accounts separator from colon to tilde.)

Regards, Ken


> David
>

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Re: What purpose is served by the Account Code field?

GnuCash - User mailing list
The Account Code is essential to me as I am using it to have a custom sorting order.So far the sorting is done correctly.
The code is just a numeric 5 digit number.
I hope no one gets the idea to remove it.Thank you all,Dorel

 

    On Saturday, February 18, 2017 9:37 PM, Ken Heard <[hidden email]> wrote:
 

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Hash: SHA1

On 2017-02-19 00:42, David T. wrote:

>
>> On Feb 18, 2017, at 5:57 PM, Ken Heard <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Since my original post I discovered that the left most column in
>> the accounts window -- whatever it may be -- is always a tree.
>> So if for example the placeholder column is placed there it will
>> be a tree, but the account name column will not be.
>
> Interesting. I see what you describe. I wonder whether it was
> intended to have the first column be the locus of the tree
> structure; it is a little disconcerting to expand the account type,
> for example. Also, I note that if one puts the Account Color in
> this position, the tree display gets messed up, with the widgets
> being placed behind the data for the next column because the color
> column doesn’t resize. I’m not sure what alternative one would use,
> however.

For me the obvious solution would be not to use the colour option, a
needless complication causing more trouble than it is worth.

> Finally, it can be confusing if you have some accounts without
> codes, as it can be difficult to determine which portions of the
> tree are expanded, which aren’t, and where one part of the tree
> ends.

I have given all my accounts a both a code and a name in both the
Account Code and Account Name fields in the format "code: name".  So
the entries in both those fields are identical, although as I have
already said I see no purpose in the Account Code field.

(In order to use the colon as above I had to change in preferences the
accounts separator from colon to tilde.)

Regards, Ken


> David
>

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Re: What purpose is served by the Account Code field?

GnuCash - User mailing list
Dorel, 
That was not my thought at all; I use account codes as well. I sincerely doubt it would get removed. 
Ken's comments missed my point as well. I was noting some of the potential issues that his discovery underscored for me. That the tree view breaks down when the color column is leftmost is a design issue that developers might be interested in knowing. 
I'm not sure personally whether I will use color there or not (because I can have a narrower left column than if I use account code). I do find that a moderately deep hierarchy (7 levels) begins to strain my eye, and having the codes lined up is easier for me. But, we'll see. 
David

 
 
  On Sun, Feb 19, 2017 at 8:55, Dorel Ciornei via gnucash-user<[hidden email]> wrote:   The Account Code is essential to me as I am using it to have a custom sorting order.So far the sorting is done correctly.
The code is just a numeric 5 digit number.
I hope no one gets the idea to remove it.Thank you all,Dorel

 

    On Saturday, February 18, 2017 9:37 PM, Ken Heard <[hidden email]> wrote:
 

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Hash: SHA1

On 2017-02-19 00:42, David T. wrote:

>
>> On Feb 18, 2017, at 5:57 PM, Ken Heard <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Since my original post I discovered that the left most column in
>> the accounts window -- whatever it may be -- is always a tree.
>> So if for example the placeholder column is placed there it will
>> be a tree, but the account name column will not be.
>
> Interesting. I see what you describe. I wonder whether it was
> intended to have the first column be the locus of the tree
> structure; it is a little disconcerting to expand the account type,
> for example. Also, I note that if one puts the Account Color in
> this position, the tree display gets messed up, with the widgets
> being placed behind the data for the next column because the color
> column doesn’t resize. I’m not sure what alternative one would use,
> however.

For me the obvious solution would be not to use the colour option, a
needless complication causing more trouble than it is worth.

> Finally, it can be confusing if you have some accounts without
> codes, as it can be difficult to determine which portions of the
> tree are expanded, which aren’t, and where one part of the tree
> ends.

I have given all my accounts a both a code and a name in both the
Account Code and Account Name fields in the format "code: name".  So
the entries in both those fields are identical, although as I have
already said I see no purpose in the Account Code field.

(In order to use the colon as above I had to change in preferences the
accounts separator from colon to tilde.)

Regards, Ken


> David
>

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Re: What purpose is served by the Account Code field?

Ken Heard-2
In reply to this post by Ken Heard-2
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I should not have assumed that just because I have no need for the
Account Code field others would have no need for it either.  Both
Dorel Ciornei and David T. use it for different sorts.  Sorry guys, my
bad.  At my age I should have learned never to assume anything.

Ken

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Re: What purpose is served by the Account Code field?

Geert Janssens-4
In reply to this post by GnuCash - User mailing list
Op zondag 19 februari 2017 06:16:36 CET schreef David T. via gnucash-user:
> Dorel,
> That was not my thought at all; I use account codes as well. I sincerely
> doubt it would get removed.  Ken's comments missed my point as well. I was
> noting some of the potential issues that his discovery underscored for me.
> That the tree view breaks down when the color column is leftmost is a
> design issue that developers might be interested in knowing.

It's good to know indeed. I don't have time to research this right now. Please
file it as a bug report to be reminded of later. I have a gut feeling though
tis may well be a bug in the underlying gtk library we depend on for our
graphical interface. Only more thorough investigation can prove this correct
or wrong.

Regards,

Geert
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Re: What purpose is served by the Account Code field?

David Carlson-4
*Bug 747333* <https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=747333> was
already filed some time ago, although that is just to document the current
behavior.

David C

On Sun, Feb 19, 2017 at 8:30 AM, Geert Janssens <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Op zondag 19 februari 2017 06:16:36 CET schreef David T. via gnucash-user:
> > Dorel,
> > That was not my thought at all; I use account codes as well. I sincerely
> > doubt it would get removed.  Ken's comments missed my point as well. I
> was
> > noting some of the potential issues that his discovery underscored for
> me.
> > That the tree view breaks down when the color column is leftmost is a
> > design issue that developers might be interested in knowing.
>
> It's good to know indeed. I don't have time to research this right now.
> Please
> file it as a bug report to be reminded of later. I have a gut feeling
> though
> tis may well be a bug in the underlying gtk library we depend on for our
> graphical interface. Only more thorough investigation can prove this
> correct
> or wrong.
>
> Regards,
>
> Geert
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Re: What purpose is served by the Account Code field?

Geert Janssens-4
Op zondag 19 februari 2017 11:45:06 CET schreef David Carlson:
> *Bug 747333* <https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=747333> was
> already filed some time ago, although that is just to document the current
> behavior.
>
> David C
>
Indeed. And I even commented on that bug, yet had forgotten about it.

Geert
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