[GNC-dev] To colon or not to colon

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[GNC-dev] To colon or not to colon

Robert Fewell-2
Hi,
I have PR563 which I want to progress and it has a couple of commits that
either add a missing colon or remove a trailing space from a label with a
colon next to a entry widget. These will require translation changes so I
was wondering if there is a consensus of whether these sort of labels
should or should not have a trailing colon.

Looking at other places, the job dialogue doesn't, the invoice page
doesn't, the transfer dialogue does, the schedule dialogue also does and
also the print dialogue mostly.

I would imagine if this was consistently done it may reduce the number of
translations a bit.

Regards,
Bob
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[GNC-dev] Translators: Re: To colon or not to colon

Frank H. Ellenberger-3
Hi Bob,

Am Do., 31. Okt. 2019 um 12:11 Uhr schrieb Robert Fewell <[hidden email]>:
>
> Hi,
> I have PR563 which I want to progress and it has a couple of commits that
> either add a missing colon or remove a trailing space from a label with a
> colon next to a entry widget. These will require translation changes so I
> was wondering if there is a consensus of whether these sort of labels
> should or should not have a trailing colon.

IMHO a trailing space should be seen as an input error and be fixed immediately.

In the times of command line interfaces, the colon was common to show,
the program is waiting for input.
This was also inherited in the first simple GUI's.
But as of today, there are other properties like text style to
distinguish input field labels from content, see i.e.
https://developer.gnome.org/hig/stable/visual-layout.html.en. So we
should remove them.

But because we usually add mnemonics, they will still in most cases
still be different from the base words. OTOH if we are consistent, we
should still reduce the number of translatable strings.

If nobody *protests now*, we should remove them immediately.

> Looking at other places, the job dialogue doesn't, the invoice page
> doesn't, the transfer dialogue does, the schedule dialogue also does and
> also the print dialogue mostly.
>
> I would imagine if this was consistently done it may reduce the number of
> translations a bit.
>
> Regards,
> Bob

Regards
Frank
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Re: [GNC-dev] Translators: Re: To colon or not to colon

Robert Fewell-2
Frank,
Yes the trailing space is a mistake so was going to get rid of that any
way, possibly it was added for alignment.

So, the only other question as part of this is whether the labels should be
left aligned or right and again there is a mix of the two in various
dialogs.
The page you linked to says they should be right aligned so there is the
minimum space between the label and control but I quite like it being left.

As part of the changes to use grids, I will probably need to set this so I
just want it to be consistent and only change it once.

Any thoughts, left or right aligned ?

Regards,
Bob

On Sun, 3 Nov 2019 at 23:08, Frank H. Ellenberger <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi Bob,
>
> Am Do., 31. Okt. 2019 um 12:11 Uhr schrieb Robert Fewell <
> [hidden email]>:
> >
> > Hi,
> > I have PR563 which I want to progress and it has a couple of commits that
> > either add a missing colon or remove a trailing space from a label with a
> > colon next to a entry widget. These will require translation changes so I
> > was wondering if there is a consensus of whether these sort of labels
> > should or should not have a trailing colon.
>
> IMHO a trailing space should be seen as an input error and be fixed
> immediately.
>
> In the times of command line interfaces, the colon was common to show,
> the program is waiting for input.
> This was also inherited in the first simple GUI's.
> But as of today, there are other properties like text style to
> distinguish input field labels from content, see i.e.
> https://developer.gnome.org/hig/stable/visual-layout.html.en. So we
> should remove them.
>
> But because we usually add mnemonics, they will still in most cases
> still be different from the base words. OTOH if we are consistent, we
> should still reduce the number of translatable strings.
>
> If nobody *protests now*, we should remove them immediately.
>
> > Looking at other places, the job dialogue doesn't, the invoice page
> > doesn't, the transfer dialogue does, the schedule dialogue also does and
> > also the print dialogue mostly.
> >
> > I would imagine if this was consistently done it may reduce the number of
> > translations a bit.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Bob
>
> Regards
> Frank
>
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Re: [GNC-dev] Translators: Re: To colon or not to colon

Frank H. Ellenberger-3
Hi Bob,

Am 04.11.19 um 12:01 schrieb Robert Fewell:
:

> So, the only other question as part of this is whether the labels should be
> left aligned or right and again there is a mix of the two in various
> dialogs.
> The page you linked to says they should be right aligned so there is the
> minimum space between the label and control but I quite like it being left.
>
> As part of the changes to use grids, I will probably need to set this so I
> just want it to be consistent and only change it once.
>
> Any thoughts, left or right aligned ?

The benefit of the right alignment: It is easily comprehensible which
label belongs to which control element. This would be harder, if you
have one long and many short labels and align them left.

Their exception is the existence of options, which depend on a
previous option, i.e. in Edit->Preferences>Scheduled Transactions
"Notify before transactions are created" is only vailable, if
"Auto-create new transactions" is enabled. I am wondering, if there is
a smarter solution.

Another question: How will the elements behave for RTL writing?

> Regards,
> Bob
:
>> https://developer.gnome.org/hig/stable/visual-layout.html.en

Regards
Frank
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Re: [GNC-dev] Translators: Re: To colon or not to colon

Robert Fewell-2
Frank,
So it looks like get rid of trailing colon/space and right align text for
normal dialogues.

For RTL, GTK already swaps the label and control along with the alignment
which I have observed on the 'View Invoice page'.

The preference dialogue may need to be treated differently, not sure yet
and there is also no indents for RTL, will need to be looked at separately
along with some other RTL stuff I have been thinking about.

For removing the trailing colon, 35 out of 66 glade files and maybe some
source files would need to be changed which is probably too many changes
for maint in one hit all be it in a few commits.
Then on top of that, changing from GTK boxes to grids and the alignment
changes, I am just not sure what to do on maint and what to do on master?

Regards,
Bob

On Mon, 4 Nov 2019 at 16:05, Frank H. Ellenberger <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi Bob,
>
> Am 04.11.19 um 12:01 schrieb Robert Fewell:
> :
> > So, the only other question as part of this is whether the labels should
> be
> > left aligned or right and again there is a mix of the two in various
> > dialogs.
> > The page you linked to says they should be right aligned so there is the
> > minimum space between the label and control but I quite like it being
> left.
> >
> > As part of the changes to use grids, I will probably need to set this so
> I
> > just want it to be consistent and only change it once.
> >
> > Any thoughts, left or right aligned ?
>
> The benefit of the right alignment: It is easily comprehensible which
> label belongs to which control element. This would be harder, if you
> have one long and many short labels and align them left.
>
> Their exception is the existence of options, which depend on a
> previous option, i.e. in Edit->Preferences>Scheduled Transactions
> "Notify before transactions are created" is only vailable, if
> "Auto-create new transactions" is enabled. I am wondering, if there is
> a smarter solution.
>
> Another question: How will the elements behave for RTL writing?
>
> > Regards,
> > Bob
> :
> >> https://developer.gnome.org/hig/stable/visual-layout.html.en
>
> Regards
> Frank
>
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Re: [GNC-dev] Translators: Re: To colon or not to colon

Geert Janssens-4
Hi Bob,

Thanks for working on this.

I would propose to do the string changes in maint. That's what is currently
being referred to for translation work, so getting string changes in there
will allow tranlsators to start working on them already now.

The other gui redesign work (converting from boxes to grids, alignment
changes,...) I'd keep for master. That would make for one big consistency
change.

Regards,

Geert

Op maandag 4 november 2019 18:45:04 CET schreef Robert Fewell:

> Frank,
> So it looks like get rid of trailing colon/space and right align text for
> normal dialogues.
>
> For RTL, GTK already swaps the label and control along with the alignment
> which I have observed on the 'View Invoice page'.
>
> The preference dialogue may need to be treated differently, not sure yet
> and there is also no indents for RTL, will need to be looked at separately
> along with some other RTL stuff I have been thinking about.
>
> For removing the trailing colon, 35 out of 66 glade files and maybe some
> source files would need to be changed which is probably too many changes
> for maint in one hit all be it in a few commits.
> Then on top of that, changing from GTK boxes to grids and the alignment
> changes, I am just not sure what to do on maint and what to do on master?
>
> Regards,
> Bob
>
> On Mon, 4 Nov 2019 at 16:05, Frank H. Ellenberger <
>
> [hidden email]> wrote:
> > Hi Bob,
> >
> > Am 04.11.19 um 12:01 schrieb Robert Fewell:
> > > So, the only other question as part of this is whether the labels should
> >
> > be
> >
> > > left aligned or right and again there is a mix of the two in various
> > > dialogs.
> > > The page you linked to says they should be right aligned so there is the
> > > minimum space between the label and control but I quite like it being
> >
> > left.
> >
> > > As part of the changes to use grids, I will probably need to set this so
> >
> > I
> >
> > > just want it to be consistent and only change it once.
> > >
> > > Any thoughts, left or right aligned ?
> >
> > The benefit of the right alignment: It is easily comprehensible which
> > label belongs to which control element. This would be harder, if you
> > have one long and many short labels and align them left.
> >
> > Their exception is the existence of options, which depend on a
> > previous option, i.e. in Edit->Preferences>Scheduled Transactions
> > "Notify before transactions are created" is only vailable, if
> > "Auto-create new transactions" is enabled. I am wondering, if there is
> > a smarter solution.
> >
> > Another question: How will the elements behave for RTL writing?
> >
> > > Regards,
> > > Bob
> > >
> > >> https://developer.gnome.org/hig/stable/visual-layout.html.en
> >
> > Regards
> > Frank
>
> _______________________________________________
> gnucash-devel mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.gnucash.org/mailman/listinfo/gnucash-devel




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